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Transcript: James Miles interview on Tibet --- d'après CNN

BEIJING, China (CNN) -- James Miles, of The Economist, has just returned from Lhasa, Tibet. The following is a transcript of an interview he gave to CNN.

James Miles

Q. How easy was it for you to see what you wanted to see?

A. Well remarkably so, given that the authorities are normally extremely sensitive about the presence of foreign journalists when this kind of incident occurs. I was expecting all along that they were going to call me up and tell me to leave Lhasa immediately. I think what restrained them from doing that, one very important factor in this, was the thoughts of the Olympic Games that are going to be staged in Beijing in August. And they have been going out of their way to convince the rest of the world that China is opening up in advance of this. I think they probably didn't want me there but they knew that I was there with official permission, and one thing they've been trying to get across over the last few months is that journalists based in Beijing can now get around the country more freely than they could before. Of course Tibet is a special example. I've been a journalist in China now for 15 years altogether. This is the first time that I've ever got official approval to go to Tibet. And it's remarkable I think that they decided to let me stay there and probably they felt that it was a bit of a gamble. But as the protests went on I think they also probably felt that having me there would help to get across the scale of the ethnically-targeted violence that the Chinese themselves have also been trying to highlight.

Q. What you say you saw corroborates the official version. What exactly did you see?

A. What I saw was calculated targeted violence against an ethnic group, or I should say two ethnic groups, primarily ethnic Han Chinese living in Lhasa, but also members of the Muslim Hui minority in Lhasa. And the Huis in Lhasa control much of the meat industry in the city. Those two groups were singled out by ethnic Tibetans. They marked those businesses that they knew to be Tibetan owned with white traditional scarves. Those businesses were left intact. Almost every single other across a wide swathe of the city, not only in the old Tibetan quarter, but also beyond it in areas dominated by the ethnic Han Chinese. Almost every other business was either burned, looted, destroyed, smashed into, the property therein hauled out into the streets, piled up, burned. It was an extraordinary outpouring of ethnic violence of a most unpleasant nature to watch, which surprised some Tibetans watching it. So they themselves were taken aback at the extent of what they saw. And it was not just targeted against property either. Of course many ethnic Han Chinese and Huis fled as soon as this broke out. But those who were caught in the early stages of it were themselves targeted. Stones thrown at them. At one point, I saw them throwing stones at a boy of maybe around 10 years old perhaps cycling along the street. I in fact walked out in front of them and said stop. It was a remarkable explosion of simmering ethnic grievances in the city.

Q. Did you see other weapons?

A. I saw them carrying traditional Tibetan swords, I didn't actually see them getting them out and intimidating people with them. But clearly the purpose of carrying them was to scare people. And speaking later to ethnic Han Chinese, that was one point that they frequently drew attention to. That these people were armed and very intimidating.

Q. There was an official response to this. In some reporting, info coming from Tibetan exiles, there was keenness to report it as Tiananmen.

A. Well the Chinese response to this was very interesting. Because you would expect at the first sings of any unrest in Lhasa, which is a city on a knife-edge at the best of times. That the response would be immediate and decisive. That they would cordon off whatever section of the city involved, that they would grab the people involved in the unrest. In fact what we saw, and I was watching it at the earliest stages, was complete inaction on the part of the authorities. It seemed as if they were paralyzed by indecision over how to handle this. The rioting rapidly spread from Beijing Road, this main central thoroughfare of Lhasa, into the narrow alleyways of the old Tibetan quarter. But I didn't see any attempt in those early hours by the authorities to intervene. And I suspect again the Olympics were a factor there. That they were very worried that if they did move in decisively at that early stage of the unrest that bloodshed would ensue in their efforts to control it. And what they did instead was let the rioting run its course and it didn't really finish as far as I saw until the middle of the day on the following day on the Saturday, March the 15th. So in effect what they did was sacrifice the livelihoods of many, many ethnic Han Chinese in the city for the sake of letting the rioters vent their anger. And then being able to move in gradually with troops with rifles that they occasionally let off with single shots, apparently warning shots, in order to scare everybody back into their homes and put an end to this.

Q. Would be false to suggest there was heavy-handed security approach?

A. Well this was covering a vast area of the city and I was the only foreign journalist, at least accredited, to ... who was there to witness this. It was impossible to get a total picture. I did hear persistent rumors while I was there during this rioting of isolated clashes between the security forces and rioters. And rumors of occasional bloodshed involved in that. But I can do no more really on the basis of what I saw then say there was a probability that some ethnic Chinese were killed in this violence, and also a probability that some Tibetans, Tibetan rioters themselves were killed by members of the security forces. But it's impossible to get the kind of numbers or real first hand evidences necessary to back that up.

Q. Form any sense of where it would go from here?

A. Well I think they now have a huge problem on their hands. When I left Lhasa yesterday the city was still in a state of effectively Martial Law. They've been bending over backwards this time not to declare martial law as they did in 1989 after the last major outbreak of anti-Chinese unrest in Lhasa. This time they have not used that term and yet the conditions now in Lhasa are pretty much the same as they were in 1989 under martial law. Officials say there are no soldiers, no members of the People's Liberation Army involved in this security operation. And yet I saw numerous, many military vehicles, military looking vehicles with telltale license plates covered up or removed. And also many troops there whose uniforms were distinctly lacking in the usual insignia of either the police or the riot police. So my very, very strong suspicion is that the army is out there and is in control in Lhasa. And removing that security given the way Tibetans are now focusing on the Olympics as a window of opportunity, removing that security now I think would be something they would be very, very cautious about. And yet there are enormous pressures on them to do so. Coming up to the Olympic torch carrying ceremony in Lhasa in June. That is one obvious event they will want the world to see and they will want the world to see that Lhasa is normal. But I think getting to that stage will be enormously tricky given the depth of feeling in Lhasa itself among Tibetans.

Q. Did you actually see clashes between security forces and Tibetan protesters?

A. Well what I saw and at this stage, the situation around my hotel which was right in the middle of the old Tibetan quarter, was very tense indeed and quite dangerous so it was difficult for me to freely walk around the streets. But what I saw was small groups of Tibetans, and this was on the second day of the protests, throwing stones towards what I assumed to be, and they were slightly out of vision, members of the security forces. I would hear and indeed smell occasional volleys of Tear gas fired back. There clearly was a small scale clash going on between Tibetans and the security forces. But on the second day things had calmed down generally compared with the huge rioting that was going on...on the Friday. And the authorities were responding to these occasional clashes with Tibetans not by moving forward rapidly with either riot police and truncheons and shields, or indeed troops with rifles. But for a long time, just with occasional, with the very occasional round of tear gas, which would send and I could see this, people scattering back into these very, very, narrow and winding alleyways. What I did not hear was repeated bursts of machine gun fire, I didn't have that same sense of an all out onslaught of massive firepower that I sensed here in Beijing when I was covering the crushing of the Tiananmen Square protests in June, 1989. This was a very different kind of operation, a more calculated one, and I think the effort of the authorities this time was to let people let off steam before establishing a very strong presence with troops, with guns, every few yards, all across the Tibetan quarter. It was only when they felt safe I think that there would not be massive bloodshed, that they actually moved in with that decisive force.

Q. At time you left, were Han Chinese moving freely back?

A. There were some on the Saturday morning. On the second day we came back to the shops and I saw them picking through the wreckage, tears in their eyes. They were astonished, as I was, at the lack of any security presence on the previous day. It was only during the night at the end of the first day that this cordon was established around the old Tibetan quarter. But even within it, for several hours afterwards, people were still free to continue looting and setting fires, and the authorities were still standing back. And it was only as things fizzled out towards the middle of the second day that as I say they moved in in great numbers. Ethnic Chinese in Lhasa are now very worried people. Some who had been there for many, many years expressed to me their utter astonishment that this had happened. They had no sense of great ethnic tension being a part of life in Lhasa. Now numerous Hans that I spoke to say that they are so afraid they may leave the city, which may have very damaging consequences for Lhasa's economy, Tibet's economy. Of course one would expect that ethnic Chinese would think twice now about coming into Lhasa for tourism, and that's been a huge part of their economic growth recently. And leaving Lhasa, I was sitting on a plane next to some Chinese businessmen, they say that they would normally come in and out of Lhasa by train. But their fear now is that Tibetans will blow up the railway line. That it is now actually safer to fly out of Tibet than to go by railway. We have no evidence of Terrorist activity by Tibetans, no accusation of that nature so far. But that is a fear that's haunting some ethnic Han Chinese now.

Q. When you were told to leave, what were you told?

A. Well I had an 8-day permit to be in Lhasa. That permit began two days before the rioting, on March 12, and was due to run out on March 19. My official schedule was basically abandoned after a couple days of this. Many of the places on my official itinerary turned out to be hotspots in the middle of this unrest. They left me to my own devices. I was stopped by the police at one point, taken to a police station. They made a few phone calls and then let me go back out on the streets full of troops and police carrying out the security crackdown. They insisted however that when my permit did expire on the 19th that I had to leave. I asked for an extension and they said decisively no.

Q. So you weren't expelled? It just ran out?

A. Well we're in a gray area here. Because in theory China has been opened up to foreign journalists since January 2007, which means no longer, which was the case before, do we have to apply for provincial level government approval every time we leave Beijing for reporting. The official regulations don't mention Tibet. But orally, officials have made it clear that Tibet is an exception to these new Olympic rules and journalists who have made their own way there, unofficially, both before this unrest and during it have been caught or ... and expelled. Or those who have succeeded in making it out without being detected have been criticized by the authorities for doing so. So one could argue that yes I was expelled, if one looks at the regulations they've announced which one could interpret as meaning we have the freedom to be where we like. But in their interpretation, Tibet is an exception and in their view they were being rather liberal towards me by letting run to the end of my official permit.

Q. Is Dalai behind this?

A. Well we didn't see any evidence of any organized activity, at least there was nothing in what I sensed and saw during those couple of days of unrest in Lhasa, there was anything organized behind it. And I've seen organized unrest in China. The Tiananmen Square protests in 1989 involved numerous organizations spontaneously formed by people in Beijing to oppose, or to call for more reform and demand democracy. We didn't see that in Lhasa. There were no organizations there that ... certainly none that labeled themselves as such. These accusations against what they call the Dalai Lama clique, are ritual parts of the political rhetoric in Tibet. There is a constant background rhetoric directed at the Dalai Lama and his supporters in India. So it is not at all surprising that they would repeat that particular accusation in this case. But they haven't come across, haven't produced any evidence of this whatsoever. And I think it's more likely that what we saw was yes inspired by a general desire of Tibetans both inside Tibet and among the Dalai Lama's followers, to take advantage of this Olympic year. But also inspired simply by all these festering grievances on the ground in Lhasa.

L'opposition tibétaine est construite par les États-Unis, c'est en tout cas l'objet d'un programme financé par les États-Unis mis à jour par la la déclassification de documents secrets.

Selon un mémoire écrit par de haut responsables stratégiques américains :
"L'objet de ce programme... est de garder en vie le concept d'un Tibet autonome, au Tibet comme dans les pays étrangers, principalement en Inde, et de construire un mouvement de résistance contre des développements politique possible à l'intérieur de la Chine communiste"

Voici l'article qui révèle ce programme :

Declassified documents shed new light on American support to Dalai Lama --- d'après Rediff on the net

Arthur J Pais in New York 16 sept 1998

Just as the United States Congress, following intense pro-Tibet lobbying by the likes of movie star Richard Gere, has urged the administration to spend annually $ 2 million in support of the Tibetan exiles, in addition to the $ 2 million annually in funding for Tibetan exiles in India, comes a revelation that could embarrass the Tibetan cause.

The Central Intelligence Agency has stoutly refused to discuss its involvement in the Tibetan struggle but the story in Tuesday's Los Angeles Times blows the lid off the Tibetan operation.

The declassified historical documents provide the first inside details of the CIA's decade-long covert programme to support the Tibetan independence movement. Part of the efforts was enlisting prestigious universities as Cornell in creating Tibetan study programmes. At the time of the intelligence operation, the CIA was seeking to weaken Mao Zedong's hold over China. And the Tibetan exiles were looking for help to keep their movement alive after the Dalai Lama and his people following an unsuccessful 1959 revolt against Chinese rule.

The assistance ended in 1970 when Richard Nixon embraced China as a bulwark against the Soviet Union. Though the United States officials including Al Gore, the Vice President, have privately met with the Dalai Lama, officially America has adopted a hands-off policy on Tibet while dealing with China. Even then the Chinese have been upset over a handful of recent American movies including Kundan dealing with the Tibet story and the fall of the Dalai Lama's forces.

A detailed story in The Los Angeles Times says for much of the 1960s, the CIA provided the Tibetan exile movement with $ 1.7 million a year for operations against China, including an annual subsidy of $ 180,000 for the Dalai Lama. The newspaper quoted newly released US intelligence documents.

Lodi Gyari, the Dalai Lama's personal representative in Washington, said last week in response to queries from the Times that he had no knowledge of the CIA's $ 180,000-a-year subsidy or how the money was spent.

"I have no clue whatsoever," Gyari said. Speaking more generally of the CIA's past support for the Tibetans, Gyari acknowledged: "It is an open secret. We do not deny it."

The money for the Tibetans and the Dalai Lama was part of the CIA's worldwide effort during the height of the Cold War to undermine Communist governments, particularly in the Soviet Union and China. In fact, the US government committee that approved the Tibetan operations also authorised the disastrous Bay of Pigs invasion of Cuba, the Times said.

The CIA documents contradict several things the Dalai Lama wrote in his autobiography, Freedom In Exile, published eight years ago.

The Dalai Lama wrote that the cut-off in the 1970s showed that the assistance from the Americans "had been a reflection of their anti-Communist policies rather than genuine support for the restoration of Tibetan independence".

The newly published files show that the collaboration between US intelligence and the Tibetans was less than ideal, The Los Angeles Times said.

"The Tibetans by nature did not appear to be congenitally inclined toward conspiratorial proficiency," a top CIA official says ruefully in one memo.

The budget figures for the CIA's Tibetan programme are contained in a memo dated January 9, 1964. It was evidently written to help justify continued funding for the clandestine intelligence operation, the newspaper added.

"Support of 2,100 Tibetan guerrillas based in Nepal: $ 500,000," the document says. "Subsidy to the Dalai Lama: $ 180,000." After listing several other costs, it concludes: "Total: $ 1,735,000." The files show that this budget request was approved soon afterward.

A later document indicates that these annual expenses continued at the same level for four more years, until 1968. At that point, the CIA scrubbed its training programmes for Tibetans inside the United States and cut the budget for the entire programme to just below $ 1.2 million a year.

The Dalai Lama explained in his autobiography that his two brothers made contact with the CIA during a trip to India in 1956. The CIA agreed to help, "not because they cared about Tibetan independence, but as part of their worldwide efforts to destabilise all Communist governments," the Dalai Lama wrote.

"Naturally, my brothers judged it wise to keep this information from me. They knew what my reaction would have been."

The Dalai Lama also noted in his autobiography that the CIA had trained and equipped Tibetan guerrillas who conducted raids into Tibet from a base camp in Nepal.

The effect of these operations "only resulted in more suffering for the people of Tibet. Worse, these activities gave the Chinese government the opportunity to blame the efforts of those seeking to regain Tibetan independence on the activities of foreign powers -- whereas, of course, it was an entirely Tibetan initiative".

The documents, published last month by the State Department, illustrate the historical background of the situation in Tibet today, in which China continues to accuse the Dalai Lama of being an agent of foreign forces seeking to separate Tibet from China, the Times said.

The programme encompassed support of Tibetan guerrillas in Nepal, a covert military training site in Colorado, 'Tibet Houses' established to promote Tibetan causes in New York and Geneva, education for Tibetan operatives at Cornell University and supplies for reconnaissance teams.

"The purpose of the programme ... is to keep the political concept of an autonomous Tibet alive within Tibet and among foreign nations, principally India, and to build a capability for resistance against possible political developments inside Communist China," explains one memo written by top US intelligence officials.

德语媒体 | 2008.06.25
西藏问题上的新看法

Großansicht des Bildes mit der Bildunterschrift: “三一四”事件时拉萨街头景象：武警戒备，但没有动武

大赦国际组织最近就西藏问题发表报告，指责中国虐待因西藏事件被捕的藏人。但德国驻华记者花久志注意到，大赦国际的报告也包含了新看法，他在日报上发表的文章说：

"这份报告主要批评中国政府在西藏动乱后系统违背法律的做法，但没有批评拉萨'三一四'暴动时中国政府随即做出的反应。按中国公布的数字，这一天拉萨有21人丧生，大多是被烧死的汉人。而达兰萨拉西藏流亡政府称，当天有一百多人死亡，藏人占多数，并死于中国安全武装的干预。达赖喇嘛接受明镜周刊采访时称之为'血洗'。

今天，对这一说法应该提出疑问。甚至流亡藏人组织'西藏人权和民主中心'的发言人也一反过去的说法，表示没有确切可信的'三一四'事件死亡人数。他认为，死亡人数超过三十人。他的这一数字大大低于流亡政府公布的数字。

实际上，'三一四'那天拉萨有一千多名外国游客，许多藏人当天还可以用手机发出照片，但直到今天，仍然没有证据证明中国安全武装力量对藏人大打出手。这个流亡藏人组织的发言人还说，'我们知道，这一天有很多人被烧死，我们不想使其政治化。'他知道，藏人对这些纵火案负有责任。但他说，他反对中国政府把西藏历史压缩为'三一四'事件的策略。而现在大赦国际的报告针对的也是这一策略。"

德国联邦议院各议会党团原来准备共同提出一项提案，要求联邦政府做出努力，使藏人获得更多自由权利。施泰因迈尔访华回国后，形势有了变化。法兰克福汇报报道说：

"德国社会民主党的人权政策发言人施特莱瑟说：'我们不参与提出这一提案。我有这样的印象，中国的事情正在发生变化。'自由民主党人权政策发言人童卡对此很恼火。今年四月，他就西藏人权问题起草了一份提案，并准备由自由民主党议会党团提出。由于这一计划得到联盟党、绿党以及社会民主党团的同意，各方就共同提出提案一事达成了一致。

现在，施特莱瑟对人权委员会的同事说，他对西藏问题提案持保留态度。这样，按照联合执政的原则，联盟党也无法支持这一提案。施特莱瑟说，'在我们与中国重开人权对话之际，这样的提案只能起到刹车的作用'。现在自由民主党准备就西藏问题展开辩论，然后单独提出西藏提案。"




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Zheng Ruolin, un journaliste chinois qui vit en France depuis près de quinze ans, a publié un article sur le site Rue89.

Cet article indique des faits nouveaux, j'ai donc demandé la source de ces faits. Zheng Ruolin m'a répondu en publiant un article en chinois traitant des nouveaux éléments de l'affaire de Lhassa et des doutes sur la réalité de la répression sanglante. VOIR CI DESSUS..

L'auteur de cet article publié ci-dessus en chinois est Georg Blume, seul journaliste occidental à avoir mené une enquête à Lhassa dans les jours qui ont suivi les émeutes.

Georg Blum a également publié deux articles en allemand. Voir ci-dessous.

Il est étonnant que l'enquête essentielle et unique de Georg Blume ait été occultée par tout les médias occidentaux.

En lien extraits en 3 Parties du débat que le PCF section Paris 20ème a organisé au mois de mai autour des jeux Olympiques en Chine et notamment autour de la situation du Tibet et de la Chine plus généralement.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x61skr ... pique_news
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x61yfu ... chine_news
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x620l0 ... chine_news

Des images associant la torture et les Jeux Olympiques circulent sur internet, elles font aussi l'objet d'un article mensonger publié dans le blog officiel du JDD annonçant qu'il s'agit d'une nouvelle campagne d'Amnesty International :
JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International pour les droits de l'Homme !

Un autre article indique clairement que ce n'est pas une campagne d'Amnesty International :
Droits de l'homme: la campagne que vous ne verrez pas



Image d'après Fenêtre sur Papillon. Cette image accuse sans preuve la chine de pratiquer la torture du waterboarding, alors que cette torture particulièrement inhumaine à été légalisée au printemps aux États-Unis.

le “waterboarding”, torture légale aux Etats-Unis

On attend patiemment un démenti et une vive indignation d"Amnesty International qui ne semble pas se rendre compte de l'impact de ses images dans l'article du Figaro.

Articles reproduits ci dessous :

JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International pour les droits de l'Homme ! --- Mensonge du blog officiel du JDD

Par Mikl07, mercredi 9 juillet 2008 à 16:31 dans International / Général

JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International En marge de l'annonce de la présence du chef de l'état français, Nicolas Sarkozy, à la cérémonie d'ouverture des Jeux olympiques de Pékin, Amnesty International vient de lancer récemment sa nouvelle campagne pour lutter pour le respect des droits de l'Homme en Chine. Pour cela, l'association a réalisé de superbes affiches mettant en scène les sports olympiques et la torture mise en place par le pouvoir chinois.


L'association Amnesty International présente très clairement ses inquiétudes sur la société chinoise. Elle se dit "préoccupée par la régression en matière de respect des droits humains à l’approche des Jeux olympiques de 2008".

Alors que Liu Jingmin, vice-président du Comité de candidature de Pékin aux Jeux olympiques de 2008, s'exclama en avril 2001 lors de l'annonce de la ville hôte des JO 2008, « En confiant à Pékin l’organisation des Jeux, vous contribuerez au développement des droits humains. », le monde attend toujours les améliorations d'un pouvoir disposant d'une emprise totale sur sa population.
Le maire de la ville de Pékin ajouta également que « Les Jeux olympiques vont contribuer à promouvoir tous les projets économiques et sociaux et favoriseront aussi notre travail en faveur des droits humains. ». C'est pourquoi, Amnesty International annonce qu'elle "prêtera une attention particulière à la mise en conformité des principes de base de la Charte olympique avec ces engagements d'amélioration que les autorités chinoises ont émises en 2001, quand la Chine a été finalement choisie pour accueillir les JO de 2008."

La défense des droits de l'Homme

A quelques jours de l'ouverture des jeux Olympiques, le développement tant attendu pour le respect des droits de l'Homme est toujours à son stade initial. La preuve, la difficulté pour les journalistes de faire leur travail lors des émeutes au Tibet. Sur son site internet, l’organisation se concentrera donc sur les points suivants : recours persistant à la peine de mort et à des formes abusives de détention administrative, incarcérations, torture, le harcèlement continu et la détention des défenseurs des droits humains, ainsi que la répression des journalistes tout médias confondu des médias y compris Internet.

Des affiches choc "China is getting ready"

Selon la Charte olympique, les Jeux doivent avoir des conséquences positives pour les villes et les pays hôtes. Amnesty International a donc lancé une campagne d'affiche choc pour le respect des droits humains en Chine, des affiches mêlant le sport olympique et les tortures perpétrées en Chine :

amnesty international amnesty international amnesty international JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International JO de Pékin : La campagne choc d'Amnesty International








Encore une fois les campagnes de l'association sont très réussies. Signée par l'agence TBWA, Amnsesty tient son rôle de dénonciateur dans un but unique améliorer les conditions humaines dans le monde.

Le site officiel d'Amnesty International France : http://www.amnesty.fr/


Cet article est un mensonge.

Droits de l'homme: la campagne que vous ne verrez pas --- D'après le Figaro

Laurent Suply (lefigaro.fr)
09/07/2008 | Mise à jour : 09:26 | Commentaires 28


L'un des visuels de la campagne avortée.

Une campagne créée par l'agence TBWA a été jugée un peu trop brutale par l'ONG. Mais elle fait le tour du web, provoquant la colère des Chinois.

Des policiers chinois qui plongent la tête d'un suspect dans une piscine olympique. Une prisonnière dont la chaîne est reliée à des haltères aux couleurs des anneaux olympiques. Un dissident ficelé sur une cible de tir à l'arc sous le regard rieur d'un membre des forces de l'ordre. Tels sont les trois visuels d'une campagne créée gracieusement par le bureau parisien de l'agence TBWA pour la section française d'Amnesty International.

Les trois affiches font aujourd'hui le tour du web, du forum chinois anti-CNN.com, qui critique les médias occidentaux en général et cette campagne en particulier, au célèbre blog anglo-saxon BoingBoing.net, qui aurait plutôt tendance à applaudir la campagne. Mais vous ne la verrez pourtant jamais dans vos journaux. Explication : Amnesty France ne l'a finalement pas retenue. Les motifs de cette décision ? Selon Sylvie Haurat, directrice de la communication d'Amnesty, ces créations sortent des « guidelines » internationales, des consignes de communications fixées par Amnesty International qui préconisent de ne pas se montrer trop « agressif » ou « brutal ». Les trois visuels « ont provoqué un débat en interne », raconte-t-elle, interrogée par lefigaro.fr. Elle ajoute que, début juin, le tremblement de terre en Chine a décidé l'ONG à ne pas « porter » cette campagne. Une décision qui n'a rien d'exceptionnelle, selon l'ONG, dans le cas de travaux réalisés gratuitement pour son compte.

Problème : « entre temps, nous avions donné notre accord à TBWA pour l'inscription de la campagne aux Lions de Cannes », le concours qui récompense les meilleures créations publicitaires. Des visuels sont donc envoyés par TBWA au jury. Qui lui décerne finalement fin juin un Lion de Bronze. Un cadeau empoisonné : ce prix donne plus d'exposition à la campagne, et les visuels, qui ne sont pas des versions définitives (Amnesty évoque des problèmes de charte graphique et une mauvaise adresse du site web, .com au lieu de .org ou .fr), sont mis en ligne sur le site web des Lions. Selon la loi naturelle du web, ils s'en « échappent » très rapidement pour aboutir sur des sites spécialisés dans les créations publicitaires, puis sur des forums chinois, dont le plus virulent, anti-cnn.com. Certains internautes chinois réagissent aussitôt au son de « fuck France, fuck TBWA ». Un ressentiment habituel depuis le passage de la flamme olympique à Paris, et qui a rejaillit sur plusieurs entreprises françaises.

La mésaventure n'est d'ailleurs pas tout à fait inédite. La section slovaque de l'ONG avait ainsi demandé à l'agence Saatchi&Saatchi de créer une campagne sur le même thème, pour un résultat assez similaire. Destinée au public slovaque, la campagne se diffuse par le web, si bien qu'Amnesty France se verra demander des explications à ce sujet par quelques sportifs français.

« Cette campagne existe mais nous ne la diffuserons jamais », assure désormais Amnesty, qui souhaite préserver son message sur la nécessité de combattre pour les droits de l'homme après les JO, et accepte ce « mauvais côté » du web qui force les communicants à repenser leurs méthodes. Pour l'heure, l'ONG continue à mettre en avant d'autres spots créés eux-aussi par TBWA, dont « Signatures », qui a reçu un Lion d'argent en 2007, ou le tout nouveau « Ne restons pas muets face aux violences conjugales », avec les stars du grand écran Olivier Dahan, Clothilde Courreau et Didier Bourdon.

Débat Chine Jeux Olympiques dans un café politique à Paris

Première partie
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x61skr ... pique_news
Deuxième partie
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x61yfu ... chine_news
Troisième partie
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x620l0 ... chine_news

PREMIERE PARTIE



DEUXIEME PARTIE



Troisième partie

«Vous, Occidentaux, ne comprenez rien à la Chine» --- d'après Libération

Pan Wei, idéologue, défend le modèle politico-économique de son pays :

PASCALE NIVELLE ET FABRICE ROUSSELOT
QUOTIDIEN : mardi 8 juillet 2008

Idéologue conservateur, Pan Wei, 47 ans, est l’un des intellectuels les plus renommés de Chine. Il est de ceux qui veulent promouvoir un nouveau «modèle chinois» basé sur l’héritage communiste et la réussite économique actuelle. Pour lui, la démocratie n’est pas un préalable au progrès, et l’Occident ne comprend pas la Chine. Proche du pouvoir, ce professeur de sciences politiques à l’université de Pékin, formé à Berkeley, aux Etats-Unis, est le héraut d’une Chine fière de sa puissance retrouvée, qui entend inventer et imposer au monde un nouveau système politique. Morceaux choisis d’un discours radical, entre propagande et réflexion politique.

Les Jeux olympiques

«En Europe, beaucoup veulent comparer les Jeux de Pékin à ceux de 1936 à Berlin. C’est absurde. Pour la Chine c’est une grande fête. Peut-être certains étrangers vont-ils manifester contre ces Jeux, mais ce n’est pas très grave, nous pouvons vivre avec. Et si quelques-uns disent qu’ils ne veulent pas venir, on s’en moque. Il n’y a aucune implication politique, les JO à Pékin, c’est exactement comme à Paris ou ailleurs.»

Démocratie

«Mettre en opposition la démocratie et l’autocratie relève d’un obscurantisme politique qui s’est développé après la guerre froide, et surtout après l’éclatement de l’Empire soviétique. Beaucoup de Chinois rejettent cette dichotomie et estiment qu’elle sert surtout à alimenter une croisade contre notre pays. La Chine actuelle ne correspond pas à l’image simpliste d’une autocratie : c’est une méritocratie. Chacun doit grimper l’échelle sociale et politique et faire la preuve de sa valeur. Le droit de vote n’est pas un droit universel, nous avons d’autres méthodes pour sélectionner nos dirigeants. Ce n’est pas une démocratie, mais pas non plus une autocratie au sens occidental.»

Les droits de l’homme


«C’est un concept développé en Occident, mais vous ne comprenez rien à la Chine. Les droits de l’homme sont toujours interprétés dans un sens politique. Mais où les vies humaines sont-elles le plus respectées? Les Etats-Unis tuent tous les jours en Irak, le discours des droits de l’homme est une hypocrisie intolérable pour les Chinois. Ici, on réduit la pauvreté, on garantit le progrès à un cinquième de l’Humanité. Le droit à la vie, le droit à l’éducation, c’est cela le plus important. La liberté d’expression n’est plus un problème, tous les ans je parle de Tiananmen. Mais un journaliste étranger a-t-il jamais assisté à mes cours? Les deux seules choses qui vous importent sont Tiananmen et le Tibet. C’est toujours la même histoire dans les journaux occidentaux, écrite par le dalaï lama.»

L’héritage communiste

«Du temps du communisme, la Chine était égalitaire. Puis nous avons appris de l’Ouest et de l’économie de marché. Mais après trois décennies de développement, le problème le plus sérieux est la polarisation de la société, les inégalités. C’est pour ça qu’il ne faut pas tout abandonner du socialisme. Certains principes, comme la distribution des terres, sont positifs. Notre nation garantit un système de défense sociale dans une économie de marché. Mais il faut évoluer. Par exemple, nous avons commencé à imposer les plus riches. L’ennui, c’est que certains trouvent toujours un moyen d’échapper à la loi. Les critiques disent que 450 millions de personnes vivent avec moins de 2 dollars par jour en Chine. C’est un malentendu : 2 dollars, dans un système socialiste, ce n’est pas la même chose qu’en Occident. Ici, les gens cultivent dans leur jardin. Est-ce que vous connaissez des Américains qui font la même chose?»

La Chine du futur

«Sans trouble politique majeur, l’économie continuera à progresser, même s’il y aura des turbulences dans les prochaines années, comme aux Etats-Unis. Nous profiterons encore de notre main-d’œuvre à bas coût, et la Chine restera compétitive. Elle deviendra plus égalitaire qu’aujourd’hui. Nous serons toujours dans un système d’économie socialiste à caractéristiques chinoises. Mon souhait est de nous orienter vers un système où règne «la règle de la loi», similaire à celui qui existe à Hongkong ou à Singapour. Avec une minorité éclairée et méritante qui décide de la marche à suivre et dont la priorité est de faire respecter le droit.